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Raymond as a child (third from left) with Geraldine beside him and other members of the Gilmour family at their home in the Creggan
Raymond and Geraldine
July 11, 2010
VOL 27 NO 28
Family celebrates the return of the living dead
For almost 30 years, former IRA informer Raymond Gilmour has been a man in hiding, a traitor to his community. He was sure his loved ones hated him, but nothing could have been further from the truth. Northern Editor Suzanne Breen tells the remarkable story of how an interview in the 'Sunday Tribune' brought the family together again
Raymond with his first wife Lorraine, and Geraldine's two sons Rob and Evan
IRA informer Raymond Gilmour has been reunited with his family after almost three decades of having no contact with them. Gilmour fled his native Derry after giving evidence against 31 men and women in one of the North's best-known supergrass trials. He was resettled by MI5 with a new identity in Britain and, to his distress, lost contact with his family.
However, Gilmour's sister Geraldine Dametz contacted the Sunday Tribune after we carried an interview with him in which he spoke of his problems with alcoholism and depression and of how deeply he missed his 10 brothers and sisters.
Dametz, who now lives in the US, says: "The last time I saw Raymond he was in court giving evidence. I was crying because I wanted him to retract for the sake of our family. I didn't see or speak to him for 27 years but there wasn't a day that passed that I didn't think of him and wonder if he was even alive. It was torture."
Dametz was so desperate to find her brother that she had asked her three children to carry out regular internet searches for their uncle. One of her sons found the Sunday Tribune article.
After we passed Dametz's contact details to Gilmour, he phoned her. "He said, 'Geraldine do you know who this is?' and I said, 'It's you Raymond.' I'd know his voice anywhere. We talked for six hours. It was like we'd never been separated.
"He remembered every little detail about us all. Our family never disowned Raymond. When he gave evidence, it ruined our lives. After the trial, I couldn't continue living in Derry. I had to go to the US and my parents went to England. I can't speak for the rest of the family, but personally I'm very proud of Raymond. If he saved the life of even one Protestant, one Catholic, one policeman or one soldier, then he's my hero."
Gilmour, the youngest in the family, was particularly close to his mother, Dametz says. "As a child, Raymond was like my mother's shadow, he went everywhere with her. She was very anti-violence and anti-IRA – that's where I think he got it from.
"My mother never stopped loving Raymond. I nursed her for three months when she was dying and all she did was talk about him. She wanted to see him one last time. She was heartbroken and it destroyed us seeing her so unhappy.
"Raymond heard she'd died and sent a wreath. He thought we hated him and told the Sunday Tribune that the wreath was probably thrown in the bin. Nothing was further from the truth. Raymond had written on the card, 'From your loving son', and that card was placed in my mother's hands in the coffin."
Gilmour is also now in touch with five of his other brothers and sisters. "He has missed out on so much but it's great that we have contact with him," says Dametz, who lives in New Jersey.
Gilmour's two children to his first wife Lorraine live in Derry. "Raymond has no contact with them. We were able to tell him how they were and that his daughter had twins and he was a grandfather."
Sinn Féin spy Denis Donaldson was shot dead by the Real IRA in Donegal four years ago. Informer Marty McGartland narrowly escaped death in a gun attack after the Provisional IRA found out where he was living in England 11 years ago.
Gilmour would still be a target for dissident republican groups or individual Provisional IRA or INLA members. "I know we won't ever be able to have a big family reunion. I've invited him to my home in New Jersey but it wouldn't be safe for him," says Dametz.
"So I'll travel to wherever he thinks safe, to the ends of the earth if need be, to meet him. Raymond rings me every other day. I leave it to him to contact me. I don't have or want his telephone number or his address."
Gilmour was recruited by the police as a teenager, first to infiltrate the INLA, then the IRA. Dametz says her family's world fell apart when news broke that he was an informer. "We were devastated. We knew we would never be able to see him normally again. He became the living dead."
The IRA abducted Gilmour's father in an attempt to force him to retract his evidence. Gilmour refused but the trial collapsed when the judge said he wasn't a credible witness. Gilmour's father was then released by the IRA.
"A few weeks later, I moved to the US with my two children. I couldn't stay in Derry. Friends I'd grown up with snubbed me. The hostility was so strong I was frightened I'd be physically attacked," says Dametz.
Gilmour's parents moved to England where they lived for six years. During that time, when Gilmour himself was living in Britain, he regularly asked MI5 if he could be put in contact with his mother and father but they said it was impossible.
Gilmour is extremely angry at the intelligence services for denying him this contact. "My mother and father would have met him in a heartbeat," says Dametz.
Informers are widely regarded by the nationalist community as traitors but Dametz states: "Raymond said he did what he did not for money but for principle and I believe him. I say that as someone who is proud to be Irish, who marches with their kids in the parade down Fifth Avenue on St Patrick's Day."
However, Dametz is angry at the IRA and the British. "Both behaved very badly. The IRA abducted my father and made life hell for the rest of us.
"Raymond was recruited by the police when he was 16, far too young to be sure of what he was doing, and then when the British had no more use for him, they threw him to the wolves and didn't look after him."
July 11, 2010
Comments
#2 David Fitzpatrick commented, on July 11, 2010 at 11:35 p.m.:
The above post is as strong an argument as you will find for the continued right of Catholics in NI to educate their children in Catholic schools.
#3 KIM STONE commented, on July 12, 2010 at 11:41 a.m.:
The brave Gilmour's of this life have played a very important role in forcing the IRA into Surrendering. During the 1990s the IRA were one the run, they had no where to go, nowhere to turn to.
You will all remember the IRA statements; its 'volunteers' will 'dump arms', pursue 'peaceful' change and desist from 'all other activities whatsoever'.
Well we know that was not true. The British Government allowed the IRA to hold on to arms. The British Government turned a blind-eye to IRA killings, bombings and crime. The IRA were allowed, they were given the green light, to continue to shoot, kill and bomb and the British Government were party to it by their turned a blind-eye. We now know that the IRA allowed its 'volunteers' to keep guns which were/are being used to carry out crime, murder. Many of the IRA men became bigger hoods than they had been before and even more IRA men became touts for RUC, Army and later PSNI. The IRA statements did not say that 'volunteers' had to desist from raping women, children and then covering it up.
It was in this very newspaper that reported; ' ... two women were raped and abused as children and that senior republicans and the leadership of the IRA and Sinn Fein have ignored their pleas for justice.'
That is what the real Sinn Fein IRA do, that's Sinn Fein IRA justice, thats what it's all about, the covering up the rape of men, women and children.
IRA crimes and abuse against children must not be covered up by PSNI. Rape against men, women and children is a heinous and vile crime. The IRA carried out the most vile crimes against their own people including, their own friends, family and neighbours.
We will never forgive nor will we forget what Sinn Fein and the IRA did to us, our children.
#4 knowtoomuch commented, on July 12, 2010 at 1:39 p.m.:
It so happens that I was in A Wing in Crumlin Road jail when most of those accused by Super Grases were there - this was not a good time for the republican movement - however - it is worth remembering that other Super Grasses who re-tracted their evidence were allowed back into A Wing with us and were allowed to fall into parade with us on a Sunday - I dont know much about Raymond Gilmore - the lads were not happy with him and who could blame them - If Raymond was a paid tout like Dennis Donaldson I cant say I would have much time for him - I prefer people who for 'no' profit decide to take on the terrorists by what ever means necessary - I wish Raymond well purely on a human level and I hope he defeats the drink problem - a problem more dangerous to our people than any Imperialist power - great story - and good luck for the future Raymond........
#5 Mr Gourley commented, on July 12, 2010 at 2:11 p.m.:
The fact is Gilmour probably did save lives but only those that the British believed worthy of life.
British agents in this field do have a licence to kill. So such agents will kill people that the British believe are in the road of 'progress' or their political agenda. Agents will be used a provocateurs and kill in that role. Agent may have to kill to protect their cover or other agents cover.
Agents like Gilmour are no heroes but are pawns in the imperialist/capitalist game. They are billigerents in a conflict.
I dont believe in the execution of informers but I do not fell any sorrow for Mr Gilmour and I think being a sad lonely drunk is nobody's fault but his own.
Informers like Gilmour are usually weak vulnerable and naive. Do they really think that once they are no use to the British that they will treat them with anything other than contempt.
#6 gearoid, belfast commented, on July 12, 2010 at 2:12 p.m.:
Gilmour chose to betray his supposed comrades, giving information that could be used to lock them up for life or get them murdered by the British government's loyalist murder gangs.
You reap what you sow. He's now a broken alcoholic living on his nerves in Britain.
#7 knowtoomuch commented, on July 12, 2010 at 4:29 p.m.:
Mr Gourley - "they saved only the lives that the Britsih wanted saved" - I think we can also agree that the PIRA done exactly the same - I remember one time when the PIRA were targeting Prison officers in a particular town - they gave the Catholic officer the chance to leave the service - while a Protestant officer who only lived a short distance away was shot dead - selective anti-imperialism I suppose or was it simply sectarian criminality......
#8 Paddy Tee commented, on July 12, 2010 at 7:06 p.m.:
The British used Ray and it was Ray who told us this. However, we also know that the IRA used many of their own. I recall the Brendan Hughes case, he too was a broken man ans also alcoholic. Sinn Fein IRA did nothing to help him until Hughes went public. The British Government, Sinn Fein and the IRA took us all for fools. Gerry Adams and those other Sinn Fein IRA men have never had it so good. Open your eyes and stop letting the British, Sinn Fein and the IRA taking you all for a ride. Ray did what he did because he wanted to save life. There is nothing anyone can take that away from him no matter what they say. Best of Luck Ray.
#9 Sally Belfast commented, on July 12, 2010 at 7:18 p.m.:
Raymond Gilmore walked the walk! Ever wondered how it is that IRA bombs were sometimes miraculously discovered and defused before they went off? Or even how the RUC (later PSNI) knew to warn certain people that they are terrorist targets? Or how the Army occasionally uncovers large quantities of explosives, hidden in terrorist arms dumps, safe-houses... It doesn't happen by accident, but by intelligence. Hundreds of people are alive in the sunshine today thanks to the people who work in the shadows. They are called police agents, spies, or informers. They are people such as Raymond Gilmore who worked side by side with the very brave men and women of the RUC Special Branch. He is a very brave man.
#10 knowtoomuch commented, on July 12, 2010 at 7:30 p.m.:
I wont name anyone - but anyone who knows - knows what I am talking about - there are many men in fancy suits who filled the books when they were in Geough Barracks or Castlereagh - as a 16 year old in Na Fianna Eireann we were told that few men lasted more than a couple of days in the interrogation centres - I lasted 7 days and managed to keep my mouth shut - years later I realised that some of those who were telling us that we would break under interrogation - were only telling us what they done themselves - some of them now wear nice suits - indeed lets not forget the clandistine meetings between Marty and MI6 Agent Michael Oakley - has anyone got a transcript of what was said....did Richie take the minutes of those meetings....one man's tout is another man's negotiator.....
#11 mr gourley commented, on July 12, 2010 at 7:38 p.m.:
In response to knows too much pieces- why turn this into a childish 'he said it first' debate. The pira are mainly made up of sectarian reactionaries only intent on changing the puppets not those that pull the strings
#12 Here Here Sally commented, on July 12, 2010 at 7:55 p.m.:
Sally is on the money.
Let all above sinn fein and IRA supports say what they want. Ray stopped bombings and killings in Derry. What is so bad about that? Many sinn Fein IRA followers go on about 'did it for money' ... if he had done it for free we would still be getting this IRA sinn fein spin. Would you do your job for Free? What I did not hear you. No you would not so what's the difference?
#13 Paddy McG commented, on July 12, 2010 at 8:57 p.m.:
This is a very sad story of one so young- only 16- recruited to grass on the IRA...
The price Ray paid was a big one and we'll never know if it was a price worth paying... For what we know his Family suffered enormously but despite this continued to love Ray despite the anguish unleashed.
I hope one day Ray tells his story- I'm sure the truth will set him free...
Until then no one can really judge him...
#14 Sandy London commented, on July 12, 2010 at 10:17 p.m.:
Ray had balls of steel. There are not many who would, could do what he done. Good luck
#15 Jaker commented, on July 13, 2010 at 4 a.m.:
I'm afraid we could see the North turn into "Nightmare 2" this recession is giving the real IRA & their ilk a boost in volunteers. And if it does start again this generation will see the horrors the rest of us saw since 1968 to 2004. Both governments must wake up & be prepared for such an outcome, by nipping it in the bud before it happens. For all our sakes.
PS. The UDA/UVF are still in the shadowy background looking on at present events. They must not be given a reason a reason to reemerge. For all our sakes.
#16 knowtoomuch commented, on July 13, 2010 at 12:22 p.m.:
Jaker - I appreciate what your saying about the 'recession' however the reality is that there never was a peace dividend for the people in these areas now dominated by the 'dissidents' - the only change in these areas was that the PIRA reduced the number of children they were knee-capping and mutilating - the 'dissidents' have no legitimacy - Michael Mc Kevitt was on the Army Council when Marty was meeting MI6 - this was about big egos and criminality - the bombs in Augnacloy and Newtownhamilton are about keeping the PSNI and Customs off the back roads so that the lads can continue to make personal fortunes, smuggling fuel, cigs and drugs, look closely at the connections in Limerick between the Mc Carty/Dundon Gang and the 'dissidents', look at those teaching the drug dealers in Dublin how to make pipe bombs and so on and so forth - unless our own people are educated in the facts of what is going on - it will continue - recession or not - as for the Brits giving two cents about Irish people killing each other - remember the famous NIO line on the murder of Charles Bennett - "The secretary of state has to look at each event in the round, to determine if the killing of Charles Bennett by the PIRA is an internal house-keeping matter or an attack on the entire community ie the Omagh Bomb".....RIP Mo.....
#17 Molly Bangor commented, on July 13, 2010 at 2:42 p.m.:
The IRA have never gone away you know.
If the IRA do try to make a return they will get the shock of their lives.
We need more brave men (and women) like Ray to stop the bombings and killings.
#18 Tom, Derry commented, on July 13, 2010 at 3:01 p.m.:
There are still many sick and sad people in Ireland. Each and every one of us must unite in the fight against terrorism. This guy played his part in that fight. Three words, Balls Like Steel. I which him the very best of luck. I would also so say to him not to let
alcohol distroy his life. He must be strong.
#19 Agent 'Badger' commented, on July 14, 2010 at 1:48 a.m.:
Ray Gilmour was one of the security services best spies. He was known to us as agent 'Badger' without doubt his work helped save many lives. When Ray left Derry it took us years to replace him. Have a pint on us Ray buddy.
#20 mr gourley commented, on July 14, 2010 at 1:56 p.m.:
There are many factors at work when violence kicks off in Ireland. There are many people with vested interest in violence. However, i think that the recent violence is groups on republican side opposed to SF creating violence to justify their existance. These groups hope that the Security forces react with violence as this will give these groups the title of 'defenders' etc. This after all is what the Provos did back in 69 remember. However, the level of oppression in the North is not as polarised as it was in 69. Therefore, save for in 'ghettos' and 'interfaces' areas and amongst hardliners in the rural areas (like O'Bradaigh), the support for violent reaction is too small for them to mount a serious threat, hence no feud with the provos, yet. The Brits see no serious threat to their system with any political or military grouping in the North. So they have not got a wider agenda to fuel the violence.
If these actions are treated as ordinary criminal acts and dealt with by the PSNI without excessive and undue media coverage then like the orange orders protests in the 90's they will go away.
After all the militarists involved are probably heavily penetrated- ever wonder why we have had only about 3 murders of security forces in last 10 years?
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Its great to hear that Ray Gilmour has been reunited with his family after almost three decades.
We are all very proud of Raymond in N. Ireland. Say what they may but Ray saved Protestants, Catholics, policemen and British soldiers from death at the hands of those INLA, IRA cowards, he took the pissed right out of them all.
Ray Gilmour is a true hero to the people of the UK. He, RUC, Mi5 and the army helped close the IRA down.
This report shows us how low those IRA scum will go when they abducted Gilmour's father, an OAP, in an attempt to force Ray to retract his evidence. Ray 'The Bull' Gilmour being the very brave man that he is refused to do so. He stood up to the IRA cowards and was correct in doing so because the IRA released his father.
The IRA scum even physically attacked members of the Gilmour family. The end result was that the IRA forced many of the Gilmour's out of Londonderry.
Its reported that, 'Informers are widely regarded by the nationalist community as traitors' but those who hold those views are sheep, they are happy to support and cover up for Sinn fein, IRA members even when they are connected to child rape ... the sheep will stand by those Sinn Fein, IRA hoods, child pedos and touts. The truth is that it was Sinn Fein, IRA who sold 'there people' out. They are now British Crown Servants, but the money is good and its coming in think and fast.
May god bless brave Ray Gilmour x